The Gas Station Incident

[mgill]

I'm hoping someone has had something similar to this happen to them & can advise me with my problem.
I pulled my '92 Sidekick (1.6 liter, 8 valve - 139,000K) into a Getty station with a near empty tank for a fill-up. I had only driven about 8 miles that morning, so I left the car running with the heater on to combat the cold New England air.
After filling the tank, I went around & hopped in the driver's seat to find the sidekick had stalled. I wasn't totally surprised by that considering the high mileage, but when I tried to start it back up, I found that it wasn't firing on all cylinders. It would run if I kept up the rpms, but it "cough" a lot & just stall if I didn't constantly give it gas. It sputtered pretty bad & I had to work the clutch to get her going down the road. After a quick debate with myself, I decided to try to make it back home.
Long story short, (I had to follow a school bus half way there) after about 25 minutes & 10 miles, I found that the symptom was gone, & everything was as it were.
Now- I had changed the wires, distributor cap & rotor (not the plugs yet, though) a couple weeks earlier, & there was little moisture in the air, regardless. Everything seems great now, but my confidence in my little truck has wavered a bit. I can't for the life of me figure out what happened at that gas station, but I'm hoping with the clues I've given, someone can tell me what it was. Can anyone offer any suggestions?
Thanks-
Mike

[Canadian_zuk]

cold New England air.


there was little moisture in the air,




Yup, cold damp New Englan air, spray everything with "dry and go" and see if it smartens it's ass up.

[TheSarg]

dry and go

Or WD-40 hehe,


also when's the last time u changed yer fuel filter?

btw welcome to zookpower newbie :thefinger

[mgill]

Thanks for the welcome & the replies. Just bought my sidekick before Christmas from a friend for $200 bucks, but she took a sticker & I want to work the bugs out before I decide she's worthy of "modifying".
I thought I should clarify that when I said "little moisture" I meant to imply that there was next to none. The symptoms were very similar to driving in the pouring rain with bad wires, however.
I did consider the fuel filter, which could be the original, but it baffled me that the problem occured immediately (when transfering fuel) then cleared up shortly after. The nature of a bad filter, I thought, would tend to gradually produce a problem. I consent that my thinking might be flawed here. I'll try a new fuel filter.
I forgot to point out that I squeezed in an extra 2 1/2 gallons of gas beyond the auto cut-off of the gas pump to try to diagnose a bad fuel gauge, which only stops at about 3/4, even with a full tank. Perhaps this might ring a bell with someone? I'd appreciate any other ideas.
Thanks again-
Mike

[MuddMachine]

Could be the fuel filter, it may or may not act up like that. I'd change it.

[Canadian_zuk]

If yer rig was running when you filled er up the fuel pick-up could have sucked some air in from the gas pouring into an almost empty tank. Or it could have sucked some water that could be in the bottom of your tank from the agitation of adding fuel while running. If it acted up for 25 min I would guess water.

[TheSarg]

What he said!

[Fullload]

I vote water/ dirty rusty fuel as well. Try your gas line antifreeze in the next couple of tanks and that should help with some of the moisture.
If you were that close to empty a fuel filter would really be reccomended as well. You just never know the last time it was done with the previous owner.

Heres a tip. Take your old filter to the parts store and try to match a cheaper equilivant instead of the OEM replacement, as they are about $30.00 CAD
I think there is about 2.2 Canadian dollars per 1 of your pounds.

[Depot]

water! Just ask Sarg bout his last bat with water in the tank! :D

try this....

remove ur high pressure fuel line from the injector. use a clear bottle. Have a buddy turn the key on (not starting) and it will shoot some fuel out for a few seconds.. do this a few times till u fill the bottle most way. Watch the bottle for a few minutes. If u have water in ur gas it will seperate from the fuel real fast and sink to the bottom.

If u do have water, depending how much will dictate how to fix it. Helpfull hints, water settles to the bottom of the tank. Ur fuel pump draws from the bottom of the tank. repeating the above process should get rid of most of the contaminated fuel but it will take time. Once ur down to an acceptable level of water, start dumping in water remover into ur tank. She'll run rough for a while till it all disapears.

Then I'd go back to the gas station and give em the bill for the bad tank of gas. had the same thing happen to me years back.. turns out when they filled up their tanks, someone didnt cap it properly and water seeped into the main storage tanks.

gl

D

[extremekickin]

(1.6 liter, 8 valve - 139,000K) I wasn't totally surprised by that considering the high mileage,Mike

Well if thats high mileage I have a 90 kick with 350,000k on it. Thats high mileage.(no motor work at all.)
It sounds like a wire or plug broke down or even the timing belt sliped a tooth.

[mgill]

Thanks-
One more addition to the story. I knew from experience that underground gas tanks inevitably have some water in them & more modern tanks even have a computer monitoring the amount of water in inches. When a fuel delivery is made, I've heard this water temporarily mixes with the gas before it settles. So it's not a good idea to pump when they are transfering the fuel. I contacted the gas station to see if they had filled their tanks that morning. The woman told me "no, but they filled them the night before, after having completely run out of regular gas."
I should also point out that the vehicle hadn't run for over a year before I purchased it, so my adding 2 1/2 gallons was putting fuel in contact with portions of the tanks that hadn't seen gas in a long time. Also, I thought the problem had aleviated itself, but it's back. Comes and goes-& when it comes there is a funny smell coming out of the exhaust pipe- not gas or oil- i can't really place it, almost like expired fireworks or model rocket engine. Does this change anyones mind, or reinforce anyones views? Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks again-
Mike

[Fullload]

I still bet rusty dirty particle filled fuel and the filter cannot keep up therefore some gets by and down into the injector.
Before you replace it do as depot suggested, with the bottle) and then take the old filter off and try to blow the old stuff out. If the filter is good ( reasonably) it will be clear gas that you blow out ( i usually use a white rag) and if not it will come out brown in colour and full of dirt and rust.

Besides why not try that first it's cheap. If i have no clue what a certain problem is i'll replace the cheapest thing first. :D

[ZookVet]

Hey, welcome aboard.
I am not up on this stuff like some of the guys, but I am thinking the exhaust may be collapsing or the cat may be bad.
Just a thought, if it was sitting so long the little rusty's had a great feed.
Reg

[Canadian_zuk]

Comes and goes-& when it comes there is a funny smell coming out of the exhaust pipe- not gas or oil- i can't really place it, almost like expired fireworks or model rocket engine.
Mike

What your smellin is sulfur, they put it in gas. Smells like rotten eggs? you need a new cat.

[MuddMachine]

Hey if you had water in the tank, for sure it's in the filter. Fullloads comment about blowing the filter out does help, although we usually do this with the Sami's cuz we can, easily. You defenitely need a new filter if it's been sitting a while and some fuel additive will help any gumming in the lines. STP Gas Treatment works great and it's cheap.

:D

[Depot]

Im even more convinced ur prob is water. the thing about water in ur gas system is that it just doesnt go away fast short of removing and draining the tank, replacing filter and blowing out all ur lines... too much work.. try mymethod and drop in a bunch of water remover.

b4 u go out and spend a bunch of $$, change out the fuel filter 4 sure and drive the cobwebs outta her and treat her to some super. Theoretically, cats should never fail unless damaged or engines been running rich for a while or dumping raw fuel out ur exhaust.

gl

D

[mgill]

thanks again-
If it gets above 0 & doesn't snow this weekend, i'm going to try the fuel line trick, as well as a least inspect the fuel filter & add a few fuel additives. I'll post back with the results.
Mike

[mgill]

Well the nuts on either side of the fuel filter were a little too rusty & salty for me to change it out without damaging the fuel lines, so I tried just putting the gas treatment to her. I drove her for a good 1/2 hour with no symptoms, so I'm pretty convinced it was bad fuel. I'll deal with the fuel filter in the summer if it makes it that long. I want to thank everyone that offered their ideas & opinions-I hope I can return the favor sometime.
Thanks-
Mike

[Depot]

send cash to...

lol :D

glad to see ur running again

l8r

D

[Fullload]

Anytime!!! just doing what we love to do!!